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I think if you look into Sri Dasam Granth, one will find Sri Akaal Ustat which is gem of gems been fully overlooked by our mainstream sikhs.

I was wondering what's the reason for it. May be they read it, yet

- they don't like the Sri Guru Gobind Singh Maharaj's whole idea of unity and diversity within humanity and all the khandan of karam kaand in sri akaal ustat?

or

- They feel insecure because it challenges their shariat Sikhi (their idolistic way of looking at rehats) and concept of Khalistan. Even though Sri Akaal Ustat does not give any explicit indictions against or for khalistan. I Still feel after reading Sri Akaal Ustat Sahib that Khalsa does not bound to any boundaries just like Vahiguroo who does not have any country, race, color, status in the soceity. The Whole world belongs to Khalsa. That's thinking khalsa should have that khalsa which is embodiment of Vahiguroo belongs to whole humanity and brings unity within diversity.

May be others can enlighten on this topic, or even correct me if i m wrong.

Gurfateh sangat jio,

I am in the process of translationg audio katha of atam gyan by gyani thakur singh ji, there was one part i didn't get which was karan sarer, you know how we are made of three layers- physical layer(asthohol), subtle layer(sukhsham) and karan layer.

What is karan sareer?

Thanks in advance.

http://www.islamawareness.net/Sikhism/

Look at nirgun and sargun conundrum Parts.

They think they have provided lot of theologial arguments on concept of God in Sikhism

~ Atamgian Katha between Bhai Dya Singh Ji & Sangat ~

For next few weeks, I be doing english translations of atam gian audio katha by gyani thakur singh ji, whole audio katha can be found on if sangat wish to listen to it.

In this thread, my brothers can also discuss further some of deep things which should be shared during the course of translation.

_____________________________________________________________________

Source: Sri Gurpartap Soraj Parkash Granth by Mahan Kavi Bhai Sahib Santokh Singh Ji.

Bhai Dya Singh Ji to the Sangat:

Our Antish karan are made of mann(mind), chit, buddh, ahankar)/conscious/subconsicous mind. In our Antish Karan there are seeds of karam.

There should be three things present and connected together in order for jiv atma(being) to do karams. These three things are :

1. Antish Karan (Mann, Chit, Buddh, Ahankar)- Mann(Mind) which makes "wishes", chit does remembering, buddh(intellect) makes the decision and ahankar which is ego that makes us superior than others.

2. Agyanta - Ignorance

3. Chaitan Atam- Soul(Pure awareness/knowledge) which gives energy to Antish karan to act.

Agyanta is main reason this being gets into vicious cycles of reincarnations, temporary stay in heaven, hell etc. One should do nishkham karam (good deeds with no desire of fruit in return) in order to rise above from reincarnations, temporary stay at heaven, realms(puri) etc

There are three stages of karams according to which one

one gets fruit (good/bad) in return.

Three stages of karam:

Sanchit Karams: It is the sum of one's past karmas – all actions (good and bad) from one's past life follow through to the next life.

Kriyamana karma: It's the karma that human beings are creating in the present, the fruits of which will be experienced in the future.

Prarabdha: Its is that portion of the past karma which is responsible for the present body. That portion of the sanchita karma which influences human life in the present incarnation is called prarabdha. It is ripe for reaping. It cannot be avoided or changed. It is only exhausted by being experienced. You pay your past debts. Prarabdha karma is that which has begun and is actually bearing fruit. It is selected out of the mass of the sanchita karma."

There are three types of fruit this being gets in return.

1. Jaat- Status in sociol and religious circle. For example- Some are consider high class, some are consider middle class and some are consider low class in aN soceity.

2. Arbal- Age in form of number of breaths this being has before death.

3. Bhog Padharath- Matter which relates to Worldly, Materialstic comforts and uncomforts.

Gyani thakur singh ji further discussed from soraj parkash granth how bhramgyani/saintly figures does not go through stages of karam- keraieman and sanchant karam because bhramgyani does not do keraiman karam with ego. There is no trace of Ego. However bhramgyani at his previous state, when he/she was in agyanta(ignorance) state, in that state kerieaman and sanchant karam been committed in agyan gets destroyed by bhramgyan(purest divine knowledge), such karam gets destroyed before they making it to 3rd stage which is parrabdh karam.

Bhramgyani with its purest divine knowledge also have destroyed their antish karan. They become one fully with divine (Sat Saroop).

Bhramgyani's man(mind) sees the supreme hidden reality unlike mere mortals, what we perceive as world is false in eyes of bhramgyani.

Bhramgyani's buddhi(intellect) have it's face towards paratma, because in essence, buddhi gets energy from atma(supreme soul). Bhramgyani's chit goes shant(peaceful silence). We do Karams with anatam( body, mind, intellect, ego). Bhramgyani does karam with atam(supreme soul). Everything which is done is done by you God. Only one and only you- God.

This mere mortal come in this world with karma, when this being give up the ego, then this being gets out from the vicious cycle of karma's, reincarnation.

As Gurbani States:

Hou Vich Aya, Hou Vich Gaya, Hou Vich Javayan, Hou Vich Mooya ||

To Be Continued:

[align=center:cc7c4079cf]~ Classical Musical rendition of Jaap Sahib Shand & Raag Kalyan ~[/align:cc7c4079cf]

right click on a download link and download it away:

http://www.khalis.net/SikhAwareness/Audio/...ag%20kalyan.mp3

well since this forum is getting back to its normal speed slowly but surely. Can anyone who knows user "Hari" on this forum personally relay my request to come back to this forum if its possible?

We surely miss his great posts.

I wanted to discuss - Gurmat Sidhant. There is lot of talk about - gurmat this, gurmat that, anti gurmat this and anti gurmat that.

- How do you define Gurmat Sidhant? Can it be defined through enternally or externally? or both?

In my views, Gurmat Sidhant created by our Guru's were very uchaie - suchaie thoughts (extremely high elevated school of thought) and cannot be bound to rules like- kachera's got off- go take pesh, or kirpan has to be certain length, certain rituals need to be performed, certain meditation postures, certain way of doing patt or interpertating gurbani, certain way of doing kirtan etc.

Correct me if i m wrong- Gurmat Sidhant created by our sikh guru's were highest most layer in sikhi then comes in layers like puratan maryada, rehat maryada - outer rehats, learning vidya etc.

This is very interesting..please keep it coming

Sangat Victorious, Committee Looses Sharaab Rights

Sunday 20th November, 2005

Panthic Weekly News Bureau

Leamington Spa, Warwickshire - Today the Management Committee of Leamington & Warwick Gurdwara Sahib has been forced to pass a resolution by the Sangat, declaring the Gurdwara a meat and sharaab free zone. The Gurdwara, was the scene of violence last week as they hosted a party where meat and sharaab were served openly to “celebrate” Diwali and Gurpurb of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. The incident highlights what Guru Sahib tells us:

ਸਰਮੁ ਧਰਮੁ ਦੁਇ ਛਪਿ ਖਲੋਏ ਕੂੜੁ ਫਿਰੈ ਪਰਧਾਨੁ ਵੇ ਲਾਲੋ ॥

Sharam Dharam due chhap khaloe, kooR phirai parDhaan ve laalo.

“O Lalo! Sharam (shame and modesty) and Dharam (righteousness and religion) both have vanished, and falsehood struts around like a leader.”

(Ang 722, SGGS)

On Friday the Gurdwara was visited by representatives from Gurdwaras in Coventry including Ramgarhia Gurdwara Coventry and Guru Nanak Parkash Coventry. This was followed by a visit from Gurdwaras from around the UK and Sangat from around the country. Gurdwaras visiting included High Street Smethwick, West Bromwich, and Willenhall to mention a few.

Today at the special General Meeting the Committee had planned to change the name of the room in the Gurdwara, to ‘community centre’, allowing the consumption of alcohol, meat and intoxicants. In a bizarre twist the plan fell on top of them as the Sangat didn’t let it pass.

In fact the actual opposite passed. Gurbani says:

ਪ੍ਰਭ ਅਪਨੇ ਕਾ ਭਇਆ ਬਿਸਾਸੁ ॥ ਜੀਉ ਪਿੰਡੁ ਸਭੁ ਤਿਸ ਕੀ ਰਾਸਿ ॥

ਨਾਨਕ ਕਉ ਉਪਜੀ ਪਰਤੀਤਿ ॥ ਮਨਮੁਖ ਹਾਰ ਗੁਰਮੁਖ ਸਦ ਜੀਤਿ ॥4॥16॥18॥

Prabh apune kaa bheiaa bisaas. Jeeo pindd sabh tis kee raas.

Naanak ko upjee parteet. Manmukh haar, Gurmukh jeet. ||4||16||18||

“I place my faith in my Waheguru. My soul and body all belong to Him. This is the faith, which inspires Nanak: the self-willed Manmukhs will fail, while the Gurmukhs will always win. ||4||16||18||”

(Ang 867, SGGS)

No sharaab, intoxicants or meat will now be allowed to be consumed, served or promoted within the Gurdwara complex and also within two years the Gurdwara Committee will enforce a full ban on consumption of intoxicants and meat on all Gurdwara property, in particular the Tachbrook Centre hall.

The Gurdwara Committee have decided to form another Committee, which will build its own Community Centre separate and independent from the Gurdwara Sahib, and will not use any of the Gurdwara's funds.

This has been a great success for the Sikh Sangat of the UK who came together regardless of jathebandi (organisations), young and old together on one platform in ekta against anti-Gurmat practises. It is a happy day in the UK and a great victory for the Khalsa Panth, and inspiring to see how the Sangat came together as one.

The Editors can be reached at editors@panthic.org

Its always been my understanding that once you become an amrit-dhari sikh - that all rituals, beliefs are to be gone but what about those individuals like i know someone who is an amrit-dhari sikh but believes in a baba vadhbaag singh and does "arti" each and every night, lights a deva in his house, but at the same time, does path and follows all the other rules.

To add to sikher post, sikhi is not black and white..rituals you mentioned each have cosmic interpertation ie- doing arti of sri guru granth sahib ji is done because one considers sri guru granth sahib as living king of kings...in puratan times, sikhs used to treat guru sahib not just by saying but used rituals like- arti to express their sharda and love towards Guru Ji...also if you can search arti in our forum..you will find flowing of discussions regarding arti.

In your freind particular case, doing arti of baba vadbhag singh ji. he can do whatever he wishes however doing arti of any one except sri guru granth sahib comes in individualistic way of life cannot be confused as a "RULE/Rituals" of sikhs as whole community.

Now lighting deva or jot has an cosmic interpertation as well...even though this tradition has been lost in mainstream sikhi however traditionally lighting a jot has a purpose..when you light a jot and start meditation..you attracting positive energies (ie- devi, devta's, shaheed singhs) to protect you from negative energies/vibes.

This person that i know of sits infront of these pictures, plays really loud music, starts spinning is head and then all of sudden is body/mind is taken over by a "baba" and then people go and do "maatha-teek" ask for relief from whatever they are having probs with he supposedly cures them?? Can this be really true? what are you guys' opinions??

This comes in individualistic way of life, should not and must not be confused as "RULE/RITUAL" of sikh community as whole.

tape 65 out of 81:

Guru Ji says:

gaavahi joDh mahaabal sooraa gaavahi khaanee chaaray.

The brave and mighty warriors sing; the spiritual heroes and the four sources of creation (born from sperm, born from egg, born from sweat(murka), born from earth) all sing about you.

Gyan Ji says: There are levels of warriors.

From socio-religious context in course of defending the dharam and humanity.

Soorma: Fights with 10, 100 oppressors.

Yodha: Alone fight with lakhs(100,000)

Athrathi Yodha: Highest of all, fight with 20 lakh oppressors but it's rare. Gyani Ji gave example from history- How bhai udhay singh ji asked siri dasam patsah to give him energy to fight all the turkhs alone. Guru Gobind Singh Ji gave him bachan- you shall be athrathi yodha. Guru Ji gave him full grace to get fateh(victory) in the battle field.

From spiritual context:

Soorma: People who ask vahiguroo to do sarvan(listening in sangat.

Yoda: People who ask Vahiguroo to do mannan(following upon listening to discourses),and acting upon (Nidhasan).

Arthrati Yoda: People who ask Vahiguroo for his full grace /prapti(to merge with God)

Soorma is also an person who ask Vahiguroo to control over vices. Yodha is also an person who ask Vahiguroo to control indraie(sense). Arthrathi Yoda is also an person who ask Vahiguroo to control over full mind.

gaavahi khand mandal varbhandaa kar kar rakhay Dhaaray.

The planets, solar systems and galaxies which are countless of them are created and arranged by Your Hand and they all sing about you Vahiguroo.

Gyan ji says: Earth, stars, planets, solar system, galaxies, realms are all nourished and managed by Naam(resonace),

Gurbani says:

Naam Kai Dharaie Sagale Janth

Naam Kaie Dharaie Khand Bhramand.

say-ee tuDhuno gaavahi jo tuDh bhaavan ratay tayray bhagat rasaalay.

They alone sing, who are pleasing to Your Will. Your devotees are imbued with the Nectar of Your Essence.

hor kaytay gaavan say mai chit na aavan naanak ki-aa veechaaray.

So many others sing, they do not come to mind. O Nanak, how can I consider them all?

Guru Nanak Dev Ji says he is only talking about seven patal, seven akash, who knows how many people are singing your praises in many different realms and in sachkhand? How can i mention them all?

so-ee so-ee sadaa sach saahib saachaa saachee naa-ee.

That True Lord is True, Forever True, and True is His Name and his Mehima(glory).`

hai bhee hosee jaa-ay na jaasee rachnaa jin rachaa-ee.

He is there, he was there in the past and he shall always be there. He shall not take birth or depart, when this Universe was created, Vahiguroo himself reside in the creation.

Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji talks about in dasam granth(akaal ustat):

Zami Zaman Kaie Bikhaie Na Samasth

Ik jot hai Na Ghat Hai Na Bhad Hai

Na Ghat Bhad hoth hai ||

rangee rangee bhaatee kar kar jinsee maa-i-aa jin upaa-ee.

He created the world, with its various colors, species of beings, through the Maya.

kar kar vaykhai keetaa aapnaa jiv tis dee vadi-aa-ee.

Having created the creation, He watches over it Himself, by His Greatness and will.

jo tis bhaavai so-ee karsee hukam na karnaa jaa-ee.

Vahiguroo does whatever He pleases. No order can be issued to Him.

so paatisaahu saahaa paatisaahib naanak rahan rajaa-ee. ||27||

He is the King, the King of kings, the Supreme Lord and Master of kings. Nanak says, one should remains subject to His Will.

Sidhas asked Guru ji to join their school of thought(mat),panth(order) and accept their customs ie- wear earings, have bowl, put ashes on your body etc. You should accept all that because we are highest of all at this time and age.

Guru ji replies to them in the next pauri.

munda santokh saram pat jholee Dhi-aan kee karahi bibhoot.

Make contentment, hesitance(refrain from doing bad things) as your ear-rings, vichar and humility as your begging bowl, and do meditation instead of applying ashes to your body.

To be Continued:

nice nice :D

Please keep them coming

very nice pictures..please keep them coming

>>> http://gurmatveechar.com/katha.php?k=bhjs <<<<

Enjoy !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

tape 64 out of 81:

gaavahi ind idaasan baithay dayviti-aa dar naalay.

Many Indra, seated upon their Thrones, sings with the deities at Your Door.

gaavahi siDh samaaDhee andar gaavan saaDh vichaaray.

The Siddhas in Samaadhi sing; the Saadhus sing in contemplatio with virtues- bairaag, vivek, moksh ichta, sarvan, manan, nidhasan

gaavan jatee satee santokhee gaavahi veer karaaray.

The celibates, the satpartagi pursh(loyal), the peacefully accepting and the 52 main fearless warriors all sing about you.

gaavan pandit parhan rakheesar jug jug vaydaa naalay.

All the Pandits, the religious scholars who recite the Vedas and got their senses in controlled, with the supreme sages of all the ages, sing about you.

gaavahi mohnee-aa man mohan surgaa machh pa-i-aalay.

The Mohinis of paradaise, queen of indera's, the enchanting heavenly beauties who entice hearts in this world, in paradise, and in the underworld of the subconscious all sings about you.

gaavan ratan upaa-ay tayray athsath tirath naalay.

All fourteeen celestial jewels created by You, and the sixty-eight holy places of pilgrimage all sings about you.

Gyani ji says: In Gurughar, celestial jewlels(ratans) are shanti, bhagti, dharam, kakars, amrit, sadhsangat, bhramgyanis.

To Be Continued:

tape 63 out of 81:

Guru Ji says

so dar kayhaa so ghar kayhaa jit bahi sarab samaalay.

Gyani Ji says: There are three so dar which comes in gurbani. Once in japji sahib, once in rehras sahib and one in asa raag. We are discussing about so dar in japji sahib.

there are many meaning of ghar for example- heart, sachkhand, sadh sangat ji.

1st interpretation of above quote if we look at it from sadh sangat context-

Where is that gate, and where is that dwelling in which everyone talks about you and remembers you in holy congregation ?

2nd interpertation of above quote if we look at if from sackhand context-

Where is that gate, and where is that dwelling in which all accepted spiritual souls who have attained enlightment engage in non-transcedental celestial meditation.

3nd interpertation of above quote if we look at it from physical body context-

Where is that gate, and where is that dwelling in which one's mouth acts like gate, heart acts like heart meditates on Vahiguroo.

vaajay naad anayk asankhaa kaytay vaavanhaaray.

The Sound-current of the countless Naad vibrates there, and countless musicians(deities) play on all sorts of instruments in that state.

kaytay raag paree si-o kahee-an kaytay gaavanhaaray.

So many Ragas, so many divine angels singing there.

Gurbani says:

Raag ek Sang Panch Barangang, Sang Allaipaie Athoo Nandan || (Ragmalla)

gaavahi tuhno pa-un paanee baisantar gaavai raajaa Dharam du-aaray.

The praanic wind(rajo guni), water(satoguni) and fire (tamoguni) devta's sing; the Righteous Judge of Dharma sings at Your Door.

gaavahi chit gupat likh jaaneh likh likh Dharam veechaaray.

Chitr and Gupt, the angels of the conscious and the subconscious who record actions, and the Righteous Judge of Dharma who judges this record sing.

gaavahi eesar barmaa dayvee sohan sadaa savaaray.

Shivji and his 11 avtars, Brahma and the countless Goddess of Beauty, ever adorned, sing about you.

To be continued:

Sikh barred entry at Legion Branch 609

By The Brampton Guardian

Nov 18, 2005, 14:05

Following Remembrance Day activities, Ravinder Dhaliwal was kept out of the Royal Canadian Legion Branch 609 clubroom because of his turban

Royal Canadian Legion branches in Brampton have been forced to change an out-of-date rule, which discriminates against some Sikhs and Orthodox Jews.

Local veterans call it a tradition that they fiercely enforce-- no "headgear" in the Legion clubroom. Head coverings must be removed out of respect for the fallen.

Branch 609 on Queen Street East enforced that rule on Remembrance Day, telling Ravinder Singh Dhaliwal, a 26-year-old Brampton university student, he was the only adult member of the community attending the service who was not allowed in the clubroom.

"It was humiliating," Dhaliwal said of how it made him felt to be singled out. He was pulled aside and told by President Marie Hayden that "headgear" was not allowed in the clubroom, including Dhaliwal's turban.

"It's unfortunate, but it's nothing personal," Hayden told The Guardian. "It's a rule. I wasn't disrespectful. I was very polite." Members of the Legion, a private club, had voted for that rule, she said, and she was just enforcing it.

Members of the community who attended the service were invited inside for refreshments. Dhaliwal, a Canadian born Sikh who only started practicing his religion about three years ago, went inside for a cup of coffee.

'Someone tell him to remove his hat,' Dhaliwal recalled hearing some people in the Legion say as he walked in after the 11 a.m. service in the parking lot.

He said he was shocked at such a policy in a multicultural city like Brampton, and embarrassed. "That's wrong," said Royal Canadian Legion National Command spokesperson Bruce Poulin last week, adding Dhaliwal should not have been barred from the clubroom.

"I'm surprised. I thought this had been resolved many, many years ago," Poulin said.

Branches were notified

Poulin and Ontario Command Executive Director Marlene Lambros told The Guardian the "no headgear" rule was modified eight years ago when all branches across the nation were notified in writing that religious headdress is an exception to the rule.

The presidents of Brampton's branches-- 609 and 15-- both say they were unaware of the change in policy at the upper tier. They said the last they had heard on the issue was in the early 1990s and the decision was left up to the local branches.

Membership of both local branches voted against allowing religious head coverings in their clubrooms and that has been the rule ever since. They feel very strongly about it, according to Hayden and Branch 15 President Jim Labinowicz.

"We have given up enough in Canada and our vets feel this is the last place they can go," Labinowicz said.

The clubroom is the area club members go to have a beer, a cigarette, and talk about the war, Hayden said. They also hold Saturday night bingos in the clubroom. The Legion is considered a private club.

He said members of the Indian Air Force have come to the local Legion two years in a row for Remembrance Day services-- some wearing turbans-- and none complained about the policy that saw them restricted to the community lounge in the Legion hall.

Hayden said the issue will be raised at an upcoming provincial executive committee meeting and Labinowicz said a Zone convention is being held soon, and he will raise the issue there.

"I think they're (Ontario Command) trying to force it on us," he said. "If provincial command says we have to do it, we have to do it... They're going to get some heat on it, I'm sure they will."

The rule exempting religious headdress is in the officers' manual issued to all branches, zone and district commanders. The most recent 2003 manual states:

"...branch bylaws and in-house policies that deny entry to members and guests because of their religious obligation to wear a particular head covering contravene the laws of Canada and section 109.b of the general bylaws."

Section 109.b of the Royal Canadian Legion general bylaws states generally that nothing be done that would "impinge" on the image and operations of the Legion.

The local controversy has prompted the Ontario Command to re-issue a circular to all branches and officers in the province, clarifying that the headgear rule does not apply to religious headdress.

Labinowicz and Hayden both said several other branches do not allow religious headdress, either. A straw poll done by The Guardian of six branches in Toronto and Mississauga showed that they all were aware of the policy, and all allowed religious headdress in their clubrooms.

However, all said they do not have any members who wear a turban, and some indicated they accept the policy reluctantly.

"Some of our patrons don't like it, but they do go along," said the president of Clarkson Branch 582 in Mississauga, who did not want to be identified. "We're tolerant here."

"We have to," said John Abbott, a long-time member of the East Toronto Branch. "It's policy right now. Any religion, we allow." "It's okay with me," said a member of the Toronto Beaches Branch, although he said it has never been an issue at his branch.

Rule change won't be embraced

The experience has left Dhaliwal skeptical about the reception any Legion branch would give to anyone wearing a turban, despite their stated policies. And locally, he agrees policies can change, but attitudes won't unless a group larger than just himself decides to push the issue.

"But you don't want to push to be a member somewhere where you are going to be excluded," he said. Labinowicz acknowledged some members will not embrace the rule change at Branch 15.

Hayden agreed the same situation would exist at Branch 609.

"They just have to accept it," Hayden said.

"A lot of policies have to change, at the Legion and other clubs. I have been trying to change a lot of old rulings and it's hard. The vets just don't want to change," she said.

Both Dhaliwal's grandfathers were Second World War veterans, he donates to the Poppy Campaign, and when he was a youngster in the Boy Scouts, he won an essay-writing contest with his heartfelt words about the importance of Remembrance Day.

"I got a certificate. I'll probably send it back," he said.

He went to the Remembrance Day service to pay his respects.

"I think it's too bad. It shouldn't happen," said Amarjit Mann, a spokesperson for the Ontario Gurdwara Committee, an association representing several temples. He said he hadn't heard of any other similar situations.

Dhaliwal said the Legions emphasize their veterans are aging and dying, and soon it will be left up to the younger members of the community to carry on traditions, but if the traditions they are trying to protect exclude people, the tradition of remembering veterans will die, too.

There were more than 34,500 Sikhs in Brampton during the 2001 census. Typically half would choose to wear turbans, according to Dhaliwal.

Dhaliwal said unless the Legion's make an effort to reach out to the community and say everybody is allowed, the membership in the Legion likely won't see turbaned Sikhs any time soon.

He said his main concern was making sure Remembrance Day services weren't exclusive.

"It's a community event, too, you remember as a community. You want to be inclusive," he said.

After his initial upset, he is now philosophical.

"I found it offensive, but more at a comedic level, now. I'm just an individual, but if my grandfathers were alive and were there, or another group of Sikh vets, then I really would have been upset."

He said Remembrance Day is supposed to be about paying tribute to all veterans, but the exclusive policy was like "selling the memory" of Sikh veterans who fought for the British Army in the Second World War.

"Thirty-five per cent of the Indian men who volunteered were Sikh," he said. "You're not remembering them."

this is one of the reasons why i personally am a little bit apprehensive abt taking the amrit. i don't want to become like this

another reason is that alot of the amritdharis who i know 'pick n choose' what they believe in

its not 'pic n mix'

having that kinda mindset has nothing to do with "amrit" itself. Amrit is ever pure, it's our own shortcomnig when we take amrit.

In puratan times, when one were to go to panj pyares to recieve amrit..they were first send to the gurdwara(dharamsala) to do seva, learn gurbani, learn bhram vidya for atleast 6 months, that would cleanse their mind and their mind will be fully determined and ready to take amrit.

Now days, panj pyares have to literally call jagiasoo and make sure if they are coming to amrit sanchar or not..

what can you say? sad state of affairs.. !

tape 62 out of 81:

aakh aakh rahay liv laa-ay.

Devotee Speak of Him continually, and remain absorbed in His Love.

Gyani Ji says: After speaking about him continually in course of finding God's end. Vahiguroo absorb his devotee in his love and give him sohang state (i m thee), where one feels no reason to find his end.

aakhahi vayd paath puraan.

The Vedas and the Puraanas and readers of vedas and puranas speak .

aakhahi parhay karahi vakhi-aan.

The scholars speak and lecture about Vahiguroo.

aakhahi barmay aakhahi ind.

Countless of bhrama's speaks, Indra deity and also ind(moon) speaks.

aakhahi gopee tai govind.

The Gopis and Krishna speak about you.

aakhahi eesar aakhahi siDh.

Eesars(Shivaji, Ganesh, Vishnu, Shakti, Karatkaie) speaks, the Siddhas speak about you.

aakhahi kaytay keetay buDh.

The many Buddhas, mahatama budda speaks about you.

aakhahi daanav aakhahi dayv.

All the big demons , the demi-gods speak about you.

aakhahi sur nar mun jan sayv.

The spiritual warriors, being who have attained matyrdom and became heavenly beings , the silent sages, the humble and serviceful all speaks about you.

kaytay aakhahi aakhan paahi.

Many have spoken of him, many are speaking about him and many will speak about God and try to describe Him.

kaytay kahi kahi uth uth jaahi.

Many have spoken of Him over and over again, and have then arisen above from five vices and maya(manmon) and reached dasam duar(tenth door) and then get departated from this world and reach straight to higher reality.

aytay keetay hor karayhi.

If Vahiguroo were to create as many again as there already are,

taa aakh na sakahi kay-ee kay-ay.

even then, they could not describe Him.

jayvad bhaavai tayvad ho-ay.

Vahiguroo(Sargun Roop)is as Great as one wishes to be.

naanak jaanai saachaa so-ay.

O Nanak, the True Lord knows.

jay ko aakhai boluvigaarh.

If anyone presumes, claims to describe God or find his end,

taa likee-ai sir gaavaaraa gaavaar. ||26||

he shall be known as the greatest fool of fools!

To be Continued:

tape 61 out of 81:

amul vaapaaree-ay amul bhandaar.

Priceless are his bhramgyani/saints, sat sangati in form of dealers and priceless are his treasures ie- Naam, bhramgyan treasures.

Gyani also talks about this tuk by looking at Satguru's showering all the graces and gifts where satguru is dealer of bhandars(virtues). He is ever forgiving and gives the treasure to everyone regardless if the person is a sinner or not.

amul aavahi amul lai jaahi.

Priceless are those who come to this earth and take priceless(bhramgyan, anand)treasures with them.

Gurbani says: Dhan Dhan Dhan Jan Aiye Jis Parsad Sab Jagat Teraya ||

Gyani ji says: priceless are also those who go to sat sangat, listen to gurbani discourses and try to follow it.

amul bhaa-ay amulaa samaahi.

Priceless is Love of Bhramgyani towards Vahiguroo, Priceless is their absorption into Bhram(Vahiguroo).

amul Dharam amul deebaan.

Priceless is the Divine Law of Dharma, Priceless is the Divine Court of Justice, King.

amul tul amul parvaan.

Priceless are the vichars in form of scale, priceless are the weights.

amul bakhsees amul neesaan.

Priceless are His Blessings, Priceless are His Insignia ie - bhagti, naam, kakar, karma.

amul karam amul furmaan.

Priceless is His Mercy, Priceless is His Command ie- Gurbani, Mukhvakh, coming into this world and going from this world.

amulo amul aakhi-aa na jaa-ay.

Priceless Vahiguroo, O Priceless beyond expression!

To be Continued:

Vahiguroo

tape 60 out of 81:

kayti-aa dookh bhookh sad maar.

So many endure constant distress, deprivation and abuse.

Gyani ji says, Gurmukh's seeks dukh so that they can get more bairaag(emotion) and meditate on more Naam. Gurmukhs beleive in dukh which acts like remedy.

Gurbani says: Dukh Daru Sukh Rog Bhaiya ||

ayhi bhe daat tayree daataar.

Even these are Your Gifts, O Great Giver!

band khalaasee bhaanai ho-ay.

By Vahiguroo's will one gets liberation from this bondage.

hor aakh na sakai ko-ay.

No one else can say anything against it.

jay ko khaa-ik aakhan paa-ay.

If some fool claims that without his will, one can get liberated.

oh jaanai jaytee-aa muhi khaa-ay.

he shall learn, and feel the effects of his folly.

aapay jaanai aapay day-ay.

God Himself knows, God Himself gives.

aakhahi se bhe kay-ee kay-ay.

However, Few and very few are those who acknowledge this.

jis no bakhsay sifat saalaah.

One who is blessed to sing the Praises of the Lord,

naanak paatisaahee paatisaahu. ||25||

O Nanak, is the king of kings.

Gyani Ji added: Patisahee is Vahiguroo who is sitting on the throne. When this being gets blessed to sit on that thorne like a king then one becomes paatisahuu.

Guru Ji then talks about next pauri:

amul gun amul vaapaar.

Priceless are His Virtues, Priceless are His Dealings.

Gyan Ji says: Sikhs are given all the virtues by satguru ie- sat, santokh, gian, daya, dharam, pyaar, bairaag

Gur Sagar Ratan Par Pooraie Amrit Sant Chugaie Nahi Dooraie ||

To be continued:

tape 59 out of 81:

bahutaa karam likhi-aa naa jaa-ay.

His Blessings are so abundant that there can be no written account of them.

vadaa daataa til na tamaa-ay.

Vahiguroo, the Great giver does not have any desire so when he gives, he keeps giving without asking anything or hold back anything.

Taamaya also means anger. Vahiguroo does not get angry at anyone.

Gyani gives an example of Mosa Pagamvar: When Mosa pagamvar asked Allah/Vahiguroo that you should make me a giver. Vahiguroo told him via telepathy try it. Mosa Pagamvar with his powers start giving daily food to everybody. After day was over, Mosa Pagamvar told Vahiguroo/Allah that I have fullfill my duty of giving. Vahiguroo said in form of akash bani that you didn't- you left one person. Mosa said that person was a sinner, when i was about to give him daily food. I saw he was committing an sin. I left him.

So Siri Guru Nanak Sahib says by giving this example how Mosa Pagamvar had dvaish(partiality) towards sinner that he refused to give him good but Vahiguroo's nature is ever -giving, he gives datta(Gift) to everyone regardless sinner or not sinner, this being cannot be giver without his grace.

kaytay mangahi joDh apaar.

There are so many heroic warriors begging at the Door of the Infinite Lord.

Gyan Ji says: There are levels of warriors.

From socio-religious context in course of defending the dharam and humanity.

Soorma: Fights with 10, 100 oppressors.

Yodha: Alone fight with lakhs(100,000)

Athrathi Yodha: Highest of all, fight with 20 lakh oppressors but it's rare. Gyani Ji gave example from history- How bhai udhay singh ji asked siri dasam patsah to give him energy to fight all the turkhs alone. Guru Gobind Singh Ji gave him bachan- you shall be athrathi yodha. Guru Ji gave him full grace to get fateh(victory) in the battle field.

From spiritual context:

Soorma: People who ask vahiguroo to do sarvan(listening in sangat).

Yoda: People who ask Vahiguroo to do mannan(following upon on sarvan of discourses),and acting(Nidhasan) upon it.

Arthrati Yoda: People who ask Vahiguroo for his full grace /prapti(to merge with God)

Soorma is also an person who ask Vahiguroo to get control over vices. Yodha is also an person who ask Vahiguroo to control indraie(sense). Arthrathi Yoda is also an person who ask Vahiguroo to control over full mind.

kayti-aa ganat nahee veechaar.

So many contemplate and dwell upon Him, that they cannot be counted.

kaytay khap tutahi vaykaar.

So many waste away to death engaged in vices/desires.

kaytay lai lai mukar paahi.

So many take and take again, and then deny receiving.

kaytay moorakh khaahee khaahi.

So many foolish consumers keep on consuming.

kayti-aa dookh bhookh sad maar.

So many endure constant distress, deprivation and abuse.

To be continued: